Isaac Oakeson: What's up, everybody? Isaac here with Civil Engineering Academy. Thanks for joining me today on another podcast episode. I'm excited that you're here. If you haven't liked us, please do so. Share this with a friend. Give us a subscribe. Leave a comment. All those things help us out. But we're excited that you're here and joining us again. You know, and we're here to help you. If you're studying to get your professional engineering license, we're here to help you every step of the way. Check us out at civilengineeringacademy.com.

Isaac Oakeson: But today, my guest is Dr. Nehemiah Mabry, he goes by Dr. Nee. And he is awesome. He is a structural engineer. He's earned his PhD from North Carolina State. He works as a bridge engineer. Or, part-time now, but definitely was working as an engineer in the structural engineering world doing bridge design, bridge inspections, and all that fun stuff.

Isaac Oakeson: He has since started a company called STEMedia, and it's been a few years now that he's been running it. But STEMedia is built around helping underrepresented groups be able to find STEM and encourage STEM, and finding a leg up in STEM through networking and courses and through media. So STEMedia is really his bread and butter and something he created. And it is an awesome resource for people that are finding their way into STEM.

Isaac Oakeson: So we talk all about his journey into civil engineering, talk about any issues that he had, successes and some failures. He gives some great tips along the way. I really enjoyed this interview. I think you're gonna enjoy it as well. And it's gonna be coming up right after this. See you in a minute.

Isaac Oakeson: All right. We are live. Dr. Nee, thanks for jumping on the Civil Engineering Academy Podcast. I appreciate you being here today.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Oh my pleasure. Thanks for having me.

Isaac Oakeson: These are always fun to do. You know, I connected with you just kind of over the internet, and the mission you guys have going on. And I really like what I'm seeing, and I just wanted to bring you on the show and talk about not only that, but your own kind of history into engineering as well. Get a little bit about your background.

Isaac Oakeson: I guess, as we kick this thing off, can you tell me just a little bit more about your own background into engineering? Why did you choose that path yourself? How did you get here?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. How did I get here? That's a good question, man. I tell you what, my dad always gets the credit for that. He recommended engineering to me. I heard the word a number of times. Of course, I knew that the person who directed or drove the train was called an engineering. That's a common thought.

Isaac Oakeson: Always get that. Yeah.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Always. And I tell you that it wasn't until 11th grade that I actually got introduced to what it really was. My dad recommended I went off this NASA summer internship program. I applied for it, got in, loved it. Loved it a whole lot. But once my dad was right. But once he knew something, right? So I got in and did that. So much so, I'm gonna tell you, that the next summer I finished this internship, they didn't have it for me that year. I was between high school and college. I just volunteered.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: I said, "Hey, can I come out and do it again? Can you put me in the lab? I'll do whatever." I just wanna continue to be around this phenomenal engineering that's taking place out here on the Marshall Space Flight Center, located there in Huntsville, Alabama. And you know, the rest was history. I got another internship the following year and just stayed with NASA, I think, for a total of about 8+ years through various part-time jobs and internships.

Isaac Oakeson: That's great. Now, fast forward, and you've got your PhD. Your doctor. And I know going into STEM can be a difficult career path. So what motivated you to go all the way to get your doctorate degree? What was the decision behind that?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah, I wish I would say that, "Hey, I knew ever since I was a kid I wanted to be a doctor." I didn't. I didn't even plan on getting my PhD when I was doing my bachelors. And I graduated when it was, you know, the great recession. That was when I came out of undergrad. And in my mind, I would just get a nice little job and start working down there in Alabama. But since I went to a number of job fairs and I found out that even the recruiters at the job fairs, weren't a hundred percent confident in their own jobs, I'd say, "You know what, maybe there's an opportunity to stay in school a little bit longer and ride this thing out a bit."

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: But here's how the opportunity really came: I saw someone in the cafeteria, I was at a restaurant, who happened to be working on the same internship program that I did when I was in high school. So by this time, we're about five, six years down the road. And I run into someone that I met my first year at NASA, and they say, "You know, here there's another program that is targeting grad students. It's called the NASA Graduate Student Research Program. If you apply for that, you'll have funding to stay in school and receive a stipend."

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: And would you know that I applied for that? I stayed in school and I took two years to get a master's degree. And it wasn't until after the master's degree that they said, "Hey, we got one more year worth of funding." I think it was up to three years of funding. "If you stay in one more year and at least start your PhD, we can get you started." And it was at that point that I really made the decision and said, "Hey, why don't this go all the way?" You know, I was out of the masters. And so I just kept walking as the doors continued to open.

Isaac Oakeson: That's great. You know, I see a lot of engineers that always question whether they should go that far or not. Do you have any tips or advice whether they should go that far? Is it a benefit for them? Is it a career choice? What what's your thoughts around that?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. So, the master's is different from the PhD in terms of its value. I think that the master's in some cases can give you a little bit of a boost in terms of your earning potential in the industry. However, PhD is not something you do just because. And I look at it, all the time I make a joke and say, "If I had to do it all over again, I don't know if I would do it all over again."

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: That's kind of what I say. But you know, it was definitely valuable to me. But here's my advice, you know, know your why. Know why you want to do it to begin with. Just simply being called a Doctor, I mean, that's cool. That's cute and all. But you could find yourself missing out on a lot of parts of life. And you know, you could really be studying and doing research that perhaps isn't even something that you want to continue doing throughout the four, five, six, or more years that it takes to get that doctor degree.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: So I would say, if you can identify what you want to do: is it research? Do you want to be a professor one day? Do you wanna work in a part of the industry that allows you to be on the cutting, bleeding edge of technology and innovation? You know, if you can identify those type of things as you're reasoning, then sure. Yeah, continue on. Because it is indeed a persistence game, not so much about being smart enough. And a lot of people could do it. You just have to persist. And the thing that helps you to persist -- The difference, right? Let me say it this way, the difference between it being, you know, unbearable and downright torture. Now hear what I say, it's gonna be unbearable at times. Period. But to make it not torture is by at least having a why and a purpose for what you're doing.

Isaac Oakeson: I like that. Yeah. I noticed -- I mean, when I was in school, I definitely had to lean on that. And it always helped when you had other people you could lean on, too. And usually, you have a good support group. You know, if you can find people you're studying with, or even counselors or whatnot. You know, people you can lean on that'll help you get through those challenging times because it can be a challenge.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

Isaac Oakeson: That kind of leads me to another question. A big part of your mission is being able to encourage underrepresented groups to go into STEM. So, knowing that this is kind of a challenging career path and whatnot, how do you get groups joining? How are you able to do that?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah, yeah. A good question. So, I brought on my father earlier. And you know, I found out that he actually started engineering when he was in undergrad. He was in college, but he didn't finish. And it wasn't because he wasn't intelligent. In fact, he actually went back into school later on in his fifties and finished his engineering degree. But as he said it, as he would say it, and I found firsthand from those who started with me and didn't finish, it is more about having a sense of belonging. Being able to see yourself in this world when it gets challenging. And being an underrepresented minority, numerically speaking, being someone who isn't, you know, represented in the traditional presentations of the field and things of that nature, you can often kind of doubt your own sufficiency, your own fitting, right?

Isaac Oakeson: Yeah. I can see that.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. So oftentimes, it's a matter of creating the image, creating a vision for others to be able to see themselves in it. And so, as I look at my career and the things I do personally, as well as my organization, STEMedia, the goal is to really change the perception of what STEM success look like. What does engineering look like? And I think it is a place that is broad enough where one can be their authentic self. They can express themselves culturally, whether it be the way they address, the way they talk, or what have you. And still be very effective, right? In the field.

Isaac Oakeson: Still be an engineer.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Still be an engineer, right? And I try to create that so that, to a certain degree, people can borrow a vision until they can have one of their own.

Isaac Oakeson: Well, yeah. I think you are a perfect example. When people see you and what you're doing -- I love what you said, "borrow someone else's vision." I think when they see you're doing it, they know they can do it, too. You know, there's so many analogies to that. Who's the person that broke the -- What was it? The six-minute mile? No one thought you could ever do that, and then they did it. And it's like, "Now everyone can do it."

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Exactly. Right. Good analogy. Easy.

Isaac Oakeson: I love it. So, why don't you tell me a little bit more about STEMedia, what you do with that, and what its mission is?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Absolutely. So, STEMedia. I'm the CEO and founder of STEMedia. And our mission is to elevate and empower unrealized STEM success. So STEMedia is an ed-tech and media company that focuses on community, content, and career development. Predominantly for young professionals in STEM. You know, about 18-35, who are also black indigenous people of color. So while not exclusively, we do have a special interest in making sure those who are, again as I mentioned, underrepresented, to broaden participation, also. Another way of statement. For people who have the mobility, who have the potential, but can use additional support simply by, again, presenting it in a different way.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: That being said, I really feel like the world is missing out, right? Inner potential is not fully realized, right? Because we don't have the inclusion that we need. Because of the brilliance and the genius that comes from having [inaudible] team isn't always accounted for. And so STEMedia likes to be one who, on one hand, creates the content, creates the material, creates the programming that allows things to be explored in a non-traditional manner. But also, we're a platform that helps to connect, you know, recruiters and talent acquisition folks, and people who actually looking to be exposed and to access a more diverse pool of talent as well.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: And so we do that, again, as service-based company and media production. But also as a platform. We have an app, we host our own events, and we'll allow some of those incidental collisions to take place within the STEmedia ecosystem.

Isaac Oakeson: That's great, man. I really do enjoy, you know, what I've learned about STEMedia and what you guys are doing. So, I think it's awesome. Love what you're doing. What do you think, I guess, now that you've been doing it for a little while, what's been your favorite part about running STEMedia?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Ooh, that's a good question. Because it's a lot of good parts. You know, it's nothing like having a creative idea and things that sometimes feel very authentic, they feel very true to who you are, but you just haven't seen it be done before. You haven't seen someone mix, say spoken word poetry with, you know, technical concepts. We need people, you know, have a DJ in the middle of a professional development workshop. Like, that isn't always the case, right? And when we do these things, but and yet find that they not only culturally resonate with people, but still people walk away empowered, enlightened, and advance in their career, there's nothing more satisfying than this.

Isaac Oakeson: And awake. It keeps me awake.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Right, exactly. Recommending it to other people, right? That's what we do. And yeah, that's one of the best parts. And then, you know, it's always cool to just ideate with my team. We sit down and say, "Oh, you know, we wanna make a video that does this and this. What are all the ways we can do this and this in a video?" And so we come up with it and next thing you know, we're shooting it, editing it, putting it out in the world.

Isaac Oakeson: Oh, I love it. I think it's good. Good stuff. Must be really fun to see that happen. I'm also curious on the flip side of things, like, what's been your biggest challenge running STEMedia? Like, what's keeping you up at night? What's something that's on your mind?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah, yeah. Well, you know, right now, I feel like it's really a moment in time with converging trends, right? You got, of course, the fact that about 70% of our GDP as a country is tied directly to STEM talent. Then you look at what COVID accelerated, what we're already headed towards, and that is increasingly digital and remote education and engagement of people in STEM, right? And then obviously, because of unfortunate things that have happened, people are starting to see that diversity, equity, and inclusion is not only the right thing to do, but people are also starting to see that it's good for the bottom line. It's actually making a difference. So these things are sort of converging, and I feel like really create an opportunity for STEMedia and other people who are missing the line to really make a difference.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: That being said, what keeps me up is this window passing. This window passing and not really being able to fully capitalize on it because of the fact that maybe, you know, the resources aren't there to really go at full speed. Or there being perhaps some things in me or my personal life or not being able to link up with the right people. Like, I think this is an opportunity for us to really, really push humanity forward by capitalizing on these trends. And we have to take the opportunity of the lifetime within the lifetime of the opportunity. And that's really what keeps me up at night.

Isaac Oakeson: Wow. That is a lot to unpack, man. That is a challenge. I think COVID and DEI, I've noticed all of those things are definitely converging right now, and there's definitely an opportunity here to move humanity in the right direction. So I like that.

Isaac Oakeson: Tell us a little bit more about the STEM Success Summit that you run. What that's about, how often you do it. What are some details around that?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. The STEM Success Summit is our flagship annual event, conference-type event, where we bring together 2000 to 3000 individuals in our community and provide them with multiple days of workshops, networking, and opportunities to invest in their career and their personal development. That being said, it was founded about four years ago. Me and my partner, Justin Shaifer at the time, got together and ideated a way to have and get this: a virtual conference. No one had ever heard about it at the time.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Now, this was pre COVID. We were ahead of the curve in many ways. It was 2019. We held our first one, that was November, 2019. And what do you know? The next year everybody was having virtual conferences. And so, finding ourselves already having our feet wet, we were to host another one. And that next one was even better. I mean, we doubled our attendance from year one to year two, got some pretty nice star power for our keynotes because people were more available. And then, year three, last year, 2022 -- I'm sorry, 2021, we also did the same thing. Leveled up our attendance, what expanded our reach. So now being three years in with the worst of COVID behind us, we are looking to have a hybrid experience this year.

Isaac Oakeson: Really? In person?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah, we wanna have a small -- Here's what we're calling it. We're calling the people who come in person the VIP experience. So, we'll have a different price point for that. But there we'll have opportunities for people to make individual pitches, we'll be able to network with a deeper engagement, right? Because we're not just in breakout rooms. And then we also look to have some special sponsorship activation there that we couldn't quite have online. So still have it online, right? Our three days of webinar. You can sign up for it. A Low barrier of entry for our reach, but then our in-person, VIP experience to allow us to have, you know, an added component, upping the ante, if you will, of what we're able to provide our community.

Isaac Oakeson: I like it. Is there anyone else doing this? It seems like you're the only one doing this.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: No, no. I mean, there are a lot of great people out there. I mean, a lot of great organizations, obviously, that are doing things. You know, NSBE, the National Society of Black Engineers is what they're known as. Society of Hispanic Professional Engineers. They're very hybrid with their events. But you know, we take pride in the fact that we are grassroots in many ways, right? We work with people who are influencers on, you know, social media. They have built their profiles being known and recognized as you know, @yourfemaleengineer is one of our friends. Or @thepeopleengineer, Engineering Memes Guy. Like we, bring these folks together and try to make suree that what we put on feels more authentic and it's more grassroots and it doesn't come across as some big entity, some big, you know, institution that's saying "Here's what you all need." But rather, we can decide what we need. And then we can partner with corporations and sponsors that want to be a part of what we're already doing.

Isaac Oakeson: That's great. I've tried to do that same thing because I know, you know, when it does get a little more corporate, it feels a little bit more out of a touch and you kind of lose that personal touch. You know, someone in the trenches that's slugged it through and gone through those challenges with you.

Isaac Oakeson: Speaking of challenges, you are a civil engineer. And I know people that listen to this, at least on our podcast and channel are typically, you know, civil engineers or looking into going into civil engineering at some level. Do you have any tips that you could share for someone that may be venturing into this world of civil engineering, whether it's college or career? You know, what challenges did you face that you noticed, especially being, you know, black as an underrepresented group? What challenges did you see that way so people, I guess, get the whole picture when you're coming to this, and maybe some tools that they could use to combat anything that comes their way?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. I'll answer in two ways, for sure. I'll answer technically, first. Of course, civil engineering, as you go deeper into a field, you realize that what originally felt like a narrow, you know, niche of a career is still broad in so many different options. So within civil engineering, I was in structures, right? Structural engineering. And then even within structures, you got your vertical structures, your buildings, you have your horizontal structures, your bridges, which is what I did. But even in that, you know, your transportation structures. You got your coverts, your tunnels, right? There's towers, right? There's so much that goes into being in civil engineering, even as a structural engineer.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: So I would say that, from a technical standpoint, you know, really hone in on what you wanna work on. You will find that something as simple as, like, different software, drafting software, is different depending on what type of projects you're working on. So you know, really trying to make sure you understand that even though you may have done one thing, and it was a civil engineering opportunity, that another thing in civil engineering could be vastly different. And so when you're doing that, I'll speak from my experience, you know, you wanna make sure you have your geometry on [inaudible]. You get those trick functions ready to, like, you know, pull up at a moment's notice. You make sure you have your arc tangents, your curves and all, you know, your go-to references for when you're actually trying to calculate things technically.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: So I'll say that's that. And that'll help you tremendously as you go forth and try to get your EIN or your pass the FE, Fundamental of Engineering. And then eventually your PE, which was a beast. We talked about this a little bit offline. But yeah, that PE is a beast. And I know you all help people with that. So this is a tremendous resource. And so I'll say that, definitely technically speaking.

Isaac Oakeson: Awesome.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: The other thing, here's the thing. And if I'm just be honest with you, man, when it comes to being a black male in the space, it is almost impossible to shake the reality, not even just the feeling of you in some ways representing, you know, so many more people. Because sometimes when people don't know a lot of people like you in a space, they infer a lot in their mind about the group of people from you.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: So what that means is, if you are making mistakes or if you're not easy to work with, whether it's just you or not, people can sometimes assume that that's how everybody is like you. Conversely, it could be the same way when you're doing good. But here's the thing, we're not in a vacuum. So when things happen, you know, on the news. For instance, when George Floyd and those things take place. You know, you still go to the office in which you're the only person that may have, you know, such a close touch point and a personal feeling of what has taken place. And what may feel like now normal, casual conversation with your colleagues can be something that really strikes the nerve with you. And so you really gotta get used to being that individual that in many ways represents, you know, your entire community. I don't think it's fair, but it is what it is, to be completely honest with you.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Other things of that nature just, you know, really include, you know, occasionally being mistaken as someone that doesn't belong somewhere. Whether you're walking in to work late or walking out to your parking lot, you know, by your car and hearing the doors locked although, you know, you worked there forever. Just different stuff like that, right? And I'm not one to continue to dwell on that, but it's real. It's real. And for some reason, you know, it takes bigger things to get an ear bent your way, right? When you try to [inaudible].

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: But nevertheless, you know, you have to get to a point to where you are committed to doing good work. You're committed to doing good work. And that, ultimately, you control what you can control. You hold yourself accountable. Yes, there is also accountability of society. But you hold yourself accountable, as well as the fact of being willing to speak up when it's time for you to do so.

Isaac Oakeson: I mean, what you described is very interesting to me and I'm curious, like, did the pressure of that, like, representing everybody because you're probably the only black guy in the office, and when society does have events like this, you know, people wanna talk to you most likely about stuff. Is there a certain degree of pressure that you're like, "I didn't wanna deal with this"? Like, I wanna come here and do my career. Because most engineers that I know, they want to come in, you know, they want to go their cubicle or whatever it is, they wanna do their work, you know, sometimes they just wanna go home. But you get this added pressure of events that are happening in the world. Did that pressure -- I mean, did that ever get to you personally?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. I think it feels more pressure before you're able to get to a point --- Or at least for myself, before I was able to get to a point of saying, "I'm not going to put the pressure on me myself. I have to always speak up. Always have to make sure things are right." Or if I do speak up, I'm still speaking on behalf of myself from one experience. And I don't have to give people the impression that just speaking to me is enough. Because it's one of these things where it's like, yeah, I definitely wanna do a good job. Sometimes I don't want to have the conversation. But also that doesn't mean the conversation doesn't need to be had, you know what I mean?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: So it is refreshing when, you know, you come across individuals and allies, as we refer at times, who want to become more acquainted, may take the cue for you, "All right. Let me not try to press Nehemiah on this or make it his job to educate me." But maybe I'm gonna speak up in another circle, or I'm gonna go take initiative to educate myself outside of just the one black guy that I know having to do it. And so, yeah. I think it's one of those things where it's like, yes, the pressure was there. Then I began to give myself permission to not have to perform. But, that also happens in conjunction with the fact that "Oh, very much so the conversation still needs to be had and very much so people still need to speak up," even if I'm not at a given moment, you know, up to doing so.

Isaac Oakeson: Right. Makes sense. Thanks for sharing that with us. I think that's stuff that we need to hear. So, that's good stuff.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Sure.

Isaac Oakeson: Jumping back a little bit to the engineering side of stuff, people struggle with these PE. They struggle with the FE. Many people fail, and even sometimes fail classes, you know? Do you have any tips when people do struggle? They fail or they have to repeat stuff. Do you have any tips around, maybe, this fear of failure and getting back and trying again?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. Yeah. So I have tips and I'm gonna speak to, it's probably not gonna be everybody, because I know you got a lot of people you help. But I know it's gonna be a few people out there that need to hear this. And that is: let go of your pride. Let go of your pride. And the reason why I say so is because I actually used to do pretty well in math classes and I passed the FE on the first try, right? PE was a totally different story. But what happened was, I developed some sort of, like, you know, overconfidence at times. And I didn't do things as if there was some more points in saying, "Oh, I didn't have to take a course," or I didn't need to bring all my references with me," or I didn't even need to study the whole thing," And I still did well.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Well, when I started to fail, part of me was just like not wanting to have to do the extra work. I mean, "I didn't have to study that hard for the FE, why should I have to do all this extra studying for the PE?" You know? Or, "I didn't have to do so much when I took this class. Why do I have to spend all this time now?" And oftentimes it's the pride. It's the pride of things. "What if I do all this and I still fail? Everything I know about myself, what I believe to be about myself might be questioned." And it's like, no. Do what it takes.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: And so one of the difference that made the difference for me was me going from saying, "I have a PhD. I passed the FE, without failing ever" and "let me just take the test," which didn't work out well, to like, "All right, let me enroll in the course." Let me make a checklist where I literally hit every single topical area that I know is gonna be on the exam. And at that point, then I can say that I gave you my best shot. But until then, it's just my pride.

Isaac Oakeson: Yep. No, I think there are plenty that need to hear that. You know, running courses, I do get to see a lot of different sides of people. And I can usually tell when people got the pride thing going on, when everything is a problem or they scrutinize every little thing. And it's kind of like, maybe they went and took the exam and some people struggle with just the whole process. They're mad at the NCEES for how they test, you know? And how they do it. It's just like, "I get it. But you know, you gotta drop that. Do what you gotta do."

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Do what you gotta do. Okay, you may be right. But don't let that stand in the way of you doing what you gotta do.

Isaac Oakeson: Exactly. Sweet. Good advice. Well, I know you guys came out with a new course. Tell me a little bit about that as we kind of, you know, wrap this thing up. But tell us a little bit about your the course you guys just developed over there at STEMedia.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Yeah. So our most recent masterclass or premium course, again, did it with a partner of mine, Justin Shaifer. It's called "Present for Profit: Public Speaking for People in STEM." And, you know, I've always had the, I would say, at least the ability to speak publicly. I didn't always like it; didn't always volunteer to do it. But over time, as I began to embrace it, you know, I kind of realized that not everybody that are in our line of work, you know, find it natural to get up and speak or beneficial. Or some people really are scared --

Isaac Oakeson: It's right up there with deaths. They're scared.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Ah, come on, man. I mean, some people would rather die. I mean, it's up there, right? And so there's a huge opportunity and a huge value proposition for our profession to help people learn how to better speak, how to better communicate. And then, those who might even have doors open for them to do it as a side hustle or an advancement to their career and bring in more job opportunities. By all means, we wanna make sure we unlock that for people.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: And so we did. We just released this course on public speaking. "Present for Profit" is the formal name, but it's a public speaking course for people in STEM. We go from everything, from how to craft your presentation, how to make sure, you know, your data and your technical information isn't all stale. How to work with clients, how to sometimes even book pay gigs outside of your day job to make sure that you can continue to expand your message and level up as a communicator.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: And we're really excited about it because people are responding and really verifying the fact that, "Oh, no. This is an issue. I've been actually running about this for a while. Thank you so much for creating this public speaking course for people in STEM." And so, if people are interested in that, they can definitely go to stemmedia.com/courses. That's how you get to a lot of our content, but stemmedia.com/courses right now is promoting that course. And we're still in the phase where we have kind of a discount pricing. I don't know when people are gonna listen to this. But I'll say it this way, as one rapper once said, "Yesterday's price is not today's price." And so, definitely, if you're interested in this, I'd definitely say go ahead and check that out.

Isaac Oakeson: I like it. I'm interested in that myself, man. You got good stuff there. That's really good stuff. We'll make sure we link all that in the notes and get that blasted away for you as well.

Isaac Oakeson: Well, this has been really enjoyable. Thanks for jumping on with me. Dr. Nee, it's been really fun to have this chat with you. Any last pieces of wisdom you got rolling around in that head?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: You know, I'll say that, and I didn't come up with it. It's from a motivational speaker, Dr. Eric Thomas, who says, "You have to take advantage of the opportunity of a lifetime in the lifetime of that opportunity." Some people recognize their gifts, their talents, their opportunities that they've been allowed access to and things of that nature. But it's not gonna last forever, right? Nothing lasts forever. Your children aren't gonna be there age forever. You're not gonna have, you know, those coworkers forever. You're not gonna always be in this stage of life that you're in now. So if there are opportunities, if there's something in front of you to take advantage of, take advantage of these opportunities of a lifetime while there's still lifetime in that opportunity. And so, I'll leave on that.

Isaac Oakeson: Love it. Well, thanks for doing this. As we wrap up, where can people connect with you? Where can they connect with you see more about you? Should we jump to the website, LinkedIn or something?

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Sure. Yeah. So, I'll say my personal website, nehemiahmabry.com. You can go there. If you wanna book me to speak, I'll be happy to do that. But even more so, stemedia.com/connect, and you can see all the stuff that we're putting out on a regular basis. Again, that's stemedia.com/connect, and you can see a number of things we got going on, both free and also that require investment. And we'll love to see you on the inside of that.

Isaac Oakeson: Love it. Okay, sounds good. Thanks for doing this. We'll connect in the future. Thanks for jumping on.

Dr. Nehemiah Mabry: Absolutely.

Isaac Oakeson: Right. See you.